[iDC] RE: An Inconvenient Youth and Second Life

Fri Mar 2 03:22:31 EST 2007

Thanks Julian and Ana. It seems that Ana was talking about 2 different
things, which are now untangled: one market share, and the other ideological
dominance. Neither would seem 100%.

I'm not an expert on games (I don't play), but from where I live, I see
Korean and Japanese dominance is at least as importance as U.S. In Thailand
Ragnarok has 1 million users and uses some kind of asian medievalist
environment. Might be patriarchal, western-influenced to some extent, but
not exclusively.

I would like to add provocatively that American-style Hollywood movies, are
a lot less patriarchal than many Asian movies, a lot more inclusive, and
actually have a lot of misandrous content, if you read this:

http://mqup.mcgill.ca/extra.php?id=51

quote: "We began this book, the first volume in a trilogy called Beyond the
Fall of Man, by noting that many pop cultural artifacts and productions from
the 1990s said very negative things about men."

Again, as a non-expert, and after reading Joi Ito's account on the matter,
do the new generations of games not include an increasing amount of
cooperative logics?

Michel

On 3/1/07, Ana Valdés <agora158 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Julian, I respect your numbers and statistics but in my experience
> almost ALL the games made "outside" the US are made with American
> prototypes and American "memes". Yes, you can see some games made for
> Israeli companiesm, but theyh are done in English, they have white
> heroes and they show male heroes.
> They can be produced "physically" outside the US but they are still a
> part of the "American way of life".
> In Lineage, the popular game played in Korea, the avatars have Western
> faces. My reflection about the US dominance was the sad constatation
> we are still reproducing an old fashioned model where
> heteronormativity and "whitness" rule.
> Ana
>
> On 3/1/07, Julian Dibbell <julian.dibbell at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Michel:
> >
> > The most reliable source for figures about online worlds is Bruce
> > Woodcock's MMOGchart.com, a paradise of market data and charts that
> > covers nearly every commercial MMO ever released. Unfortunately Bruce
> > doesn't break things down by corporate nationality, but I did some
> > follow-up research through Wikipedia et al, and it turns out you're
> > right to be skeptical: The U.S. may dominate this market's supply
> > side, but the dominance isn't even close to 100%.
> >
> > Here's the breakdown:
> >
> > There are 39 titles listed on MMOGchart.com, not counting sequels. Of
> > those, 24 were developed by U.S. companies. That's just a little more
> > than 60%. If you leave out U.S. games with non-U.S. publishers
> > (France's Vivendi and Ubisoft, for instance, market several U.S.-made
> > MMOs, as does Korea's NCSoft), the number of titles goes down to 17,
> > or less than 45%.
> >
> > These numbers tell us nothing about market share, of course, but from
> > that perspective the picture doesn't look much different. If you look
> > at the market-share chart for subscription-based MMOs
> > (http://www.mmogchart.com/chart7.html), you see World of Warcraft (a
> > Franco-U.S. production) with a crushing 52.9%. But even with WoW
> > pulling that much weight, U.S.-made games get only 61.3% of the
> > market. Games developed in Korea, the U.K., Japan, Iceland, and France
> > get 34.3% (with the remaining 3.3% swept into an unalyzable "All
> > others" category).
> >
> > And keep in mind that this is only subscription-based games. There is
> > a hugely popular class of Asian MMOs that get their revenues from item
> > sales and so forth, and Bruce lists them separately, since it's hard
> > to compare 'active subscribers' to the 'average concurrent users'
> > figure typically used to measure these games. But back-of-the-envelope
> > calculations suggest that adding these games in to the mix would
> > create a picture in which U.S. MMOs' market share is considerably less
> > than 50%.
> >
> > Finally, I'll point out that Bruce, for whatever reason, doesn't even
> > mention several very popular online game worlds aimed at children or
> > teens, such as Neopets, Club Penguin, and Habbo Hotel. These three
> > come off the top of my head, and their creators are, respectively,
> > British, Canadian, and Finnish.
> >
> > Julian
> >
> >
> >
> > On 3/1/07, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Would be curious to any pointers confirming that the U.S. is
> responsible for
> > > almost 100% of computer games and online worlds ...
> > >
> > > Recently, someone mentioned something like 'most Africans are now
> connected
> > > with mobile phones'. I checked, it is only 10%.
> > >
> > > Michel Bauwens
> > >
> > >
> > > On 2/28/07, Ana Valdés <agora158 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > That's exact my point when I refered to my short experience in SL. I
> > > > think the US (where almost 100 procent of computer games and online
> > > > worlds are created) has a problem with the reproduction of the
> nuclear
> > > > family and the wishing of a kind of Barbie/Ken archetype where the
> > > > same house, the same furniture and the same tables and chairs are
> > > > copied or cloned.
> > > > In SL you can find hundreds of reproductions of Le Corbusier or of
> > > > Frank Lloyd Right, it's as the Sims (the popular computer game who
> is
> > > > the most clear "parent" of Second Life, has discovered architecture
> > > > and city planning.
> > > > When you have characters who fly what's the point making stairs or
> > > > walls? Or to design roads or motorways?
> > > > For me SL is a kind of perverse reproduction of life but without
> > > > death, sweat, smells or poverty.
> > > > In Everquest, the online game I usually played for several years, I
> > > > was playing a female avatar and  another player, a man playing
> another
> > > > female avatar, asked me to marry "him".
> > > > The marriage thing was a cool thing in EQ, where the weddings in the
> > > > game were attended by guests from the whole virtual world. I have
> > > > attended marriages between vampyres and elfs, centaurs and frogs.
> > > > We asked the "game masters" to come and marry us, it was Sony's
> > > > employees who acted as priests or civil servants and who performed
> the
> > > > ceremonies.
> > > > We got a letter, very polite, but they refused us the right to be
> > > > married, "two women avatars can't be married. It could upset a lot
> of
> > > > other players who could experience that as offensive".
> > > > We, Charles, my friend, and me, could not believe what we read. We
> > > > played as wizards and shamans, we fought demons and zombies, we
> lived
> > > > in a fantasy world where magic and phantasy played an enormous roll.
> > > > Did they mean that two female avatars were "not natural", but all
> the
> > > > other stuff was it???
> > > > We argued with them for months and we dropped the idea, but it
> > > > strenghtened my these about online worlds as very conservative and
> > > > oldfashioned.
> > > > Ana
> > > >
> > > > ps. the description of the marriage it's a bit of my research about
> > > > Gender in the Online Games, I am writing a book which it's going to
> be
> > > > released in this Spring, sadly, only in Swedish and Spanish for the
> > > > moment.
> > > >
> > > > On 2/27/07, Brooke Knight <brooke_knight at emerson.edu> wrote:
> > > > > Hi all:
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm an inveterate lurker on the list, but I have to pick up on
> Steven's
> > > > > comment a few days ago about how he gave a lecture about SL, both
> in the
> > > > > "real" world and the "virtual" world of Second Life.  We here at
> Emerson
> > > > > College are currently engaged in the same thing -- as it is
> opening up
> > > as an
> > > > > educational space.  We have students cranking away at building
> what are
> > > > > essentially avatars of our buildings.  In fact, we have an event
> > > tomorrow,
> > > > > where both Trebor and Ulises will be speaking at Emerson and on
> Second
> > > Life,
> > > > > on the Emerson College Island, Emerson Island (145, 109,
> 23).  Come by
> > > at 7
> > > > > eastern and see if it works.
> > > > >
> > > > > In this case, it will be inside the Bordy Theater on the
> island.  In the
> > > > > "real" world (I've never been comfortable with the distinction),
> the
> > > Bordy
> > > > > Theater is inside of a building alongside other buildings of the
> same
> > > height
> > > > > and size.  On Emerson Island, It stands out as one of the only
> objects
> > > > > there.
> > > > >
> > > > > So, I ask -- why is it that there seems to be a need to reproduce
> items
> > > that
> > > > > already exist? Is a replica of a real-world place the best way to
> convey
> > > a
> > > > > message, even if it doesn't work in SL?  How is that message
> different
> > > in
> > > > > SL?
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm just worried that we continue to experience the tyranny of the
> > > metaphor,
> > > > > as we have so many times in digital media.
> > > > >
> > > > > Best,
> > > > >
> > > > > Brooke
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Brooke A. Knight
> > > > >
> > > > > Assistant Professor of New Media
> > > > >
> > > > > Department of Visual and Media Arts
> > > > >
> > > > > Emerson College
> > > > >
> > > > > 617-824-8760
> > > > >
> > > > > brooke_knight at emerson.edu
> > > > >
> > > > > www.brookeknight.com
> > > > >
> > > > >
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> --
> Skarpnäcks Allé 45 ll tr
> 12833 Skarpnäck
> Sweden
> tel +468-943288
> mobil 4670-3213370
>
>
> "When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth
> with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you
> will always long to return.
> — Leonardo da Vinci
>

-- 
The P2P Foundation researches, documents and promotes peer to peer
alternatives.

Wiki and Encyclopedia, at http://p2pfoundation.net; Blog, at
http://blog.p2pfoundation.net; Newsletter, at
http://integralvisioning.org/index.php?topic=p2p

Basic essay at http://www.ctheory.net/articles.aspx?id=499; interview at
http://poynder.blogspot.com/2006/09/p2p-very-core-of-world-to-come.html;
video interview, at
http://www.masternewmedia.org/news/2006/09/29/network_collaboration_peer_to_peer.htm

The work of the P2P Foundation is supported by
http://www.ws-network.com/04_team.htm
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